Author Topic: Disappointing  (Read 835 times)

Offline Gray Cloud

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Disappointing
« on: October 31, 2018, 03:58:49 pm »
I just found this forum, but I'm already prepared to abandon it. I've asked a couple questions that I think many new students might want answers to. Instead I am given sarcasm, pomposity and bickering.

Who needs it.

Goodbye.

Offline VisuddhiRaptor

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Re: Disappointing
« Reply #1 on: October 31, 2018, 06:32:51 pm »
Sounds like lots of ingratitude.  :bigtears:

Offline zafrogzen

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Re: Disappointing
« Reply #2 on: November 01, 2018, 06:56:40 pm »
I just found this forum, but I'm already prepared to abandon it. I've asked a couple questions that I think many new students might want answers to. Instead I am given sarcasm, pomposity and bickering.

Who needs it.

Goodbye.

I have to agree. The level of discourse here, always erratic, has reached a new low lately. There’s sweeping judgmental statements like “that’s crap” or “drivel” by someone who, when challenged to elaborate and defend those statements, resorts to personal insults or else suddenly disappears.

And then there’s the long post after long post of Sutta segments culled from other sites like accesstoinsight. A little of that is fine, especially if it’s done to back up something original. But excessive quoting of scripture starts to get a little overbearing and tedious after awhile. In the Zen Ox-hearding pictures it’s called seeing the “tracks” of the Ox – a long way from seeing the Ox itself, much less riding it home.
My first formal meditation training was with Shunryu Suzuki in the 60's and later with Kobun, Robert Aitken and many other teachers (mainly zen). However, I've spent the most time practicing on my own, which is all I do now. I'm living in a rather isolated area so I miss connecting with other practitioners. Despite my interest in zen I've made an effort to remain secular. You can visit my website at http://www.frogzen.com

Offline meez

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Re: Disappointing
« Reply #3 on: November 02, 2018, 09:33:03 am »
If anyone is willing to step in and help limit the amount of unnecessary or redundant posts, let me know.  Along with that, if there is a feeling of general negativity, I'd like to be made aware of that as well.  I'm not a big fan of outright censorship on differing views or even "spirited" replies, but if there is a line that gets crossed, I think it's worth addressing the matter.

Offline Chaz

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Re: Disappointing
« Reply #4 on: November 02, 2018, 09:39:32 am »
And then there’s the long post after long post of Sutta segments culled from other sites like accesstoinsight. A little of that is fine, especially if it’s done to back up something original. But excessive quoting of scripture starts to get a little overbearing and tedious after awhile.

Yes.  Tedious.

It's something you see online but almost nowhere else  I've studied with a number of teachers from various traditions over the years and while they may be teaching from a particular source, they eschew the chapter & verse habit certain online Buddhists embrace. 

Nothing wrong with knowing your scripture, but so often, someone will ask a very simple question, only to be answered by 500 words copy/pasted from ATI.  It's overwhelming.

Some folks weaponize suttas.  Some Buddhist admits to taking a bong hit or two and next thing you know he's being beaten about the head and neck with the precepts.

Anybody can read through the sutta on AIT and copy/paste the contents everywhere as if it's meaningful or applicable.  A lot of time it's boring as hell.  It shows no sympathy, empathy, wisdom, understanding or compassion.  It's just a lot of words that anyone with a cell phone could post.

And who reads all that stuff?  People reading online don't actually read every word.  They scan it.  So they're catching maybe one word in 5.  If it takes more than 200-300 words, you've lost them.




Offline zafrogzen

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Re: Disappointing
« Reply #5 on: November 02, 2018, 09:53:09 am »
If anyone is willing to step in and help limit the amount of unnecessary or redundant posts, let me know.  Along with that, if there is a feeling of general negativity, I'd like to be made aware of that as well.  I'm not a big fan of outright censorship on differing views or even "spirited" replies, but if there is a line that gets crossed, I think it's worth addressing the matter.

Maybe we can self-regulate. I appreciated the freedom of expression here. I'm a little embarrassed to be listing someone else's faults -- which is just another fault on my part, but I'm not perfect either.
My first formal meditation training was with Shunryu Suzuki in the 60's and later with Kobun, Robert Aitken and many other teachers (mainly zen). However, I've spent the most time practicing on my own, which is all I do now. I'm living in a rather isolated area so I miss connecting with other practitioners. Despite my interest in zen I've made an effort to remain secular. You can visit my website at http://www.frogzen.com

Offline KathyLauren

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Re: Disappointing
« Reply #6 on: November 02, 2018, 10:24:34 am »
Gray Cloud, I do not disagree.  It is not just this forum.  On all the Buddhism forums I have been on, and there have been quite a few, at least 80% of the members are more interested in sarcasm, pomposity and bickering than in helping questioners. 

It is bearable on forums that are large enough to have the remaining 20% include intelligent, well-informed, helpful people.  Unfortunately, this forum doesn't get enough traffic for that.

Om mani padme hum
Kathy

Offline zafrogzen

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Re: Disappointing
« Reply #7 on: November 03, 2018, 11:40:45 am »
I take back what I said about "self regulation." This troll definitely crosses the line.
My first formal meditation training was with Shunryu Suzuki in the 60's and later with Kobun, Robert Aitken and many other teachers (mainly zen). However, I've spent the most time practicing on my own, which is all I do now. I'm living in a rather isolated area so I miss connecting with other practitioners. Despite my interest in zen I've made an effort to remain secular. You can visit my website at http://www.frogzen.com

Offline MightyPenis

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Re: Disappointing
« Reply #8 on: November 03, 2018, 01:04:06 pm »
I take back what I said about "self regulation." This troll definitely crosses the line.

Troll? I happen to know for a fact Buddha condemned name-calling. In fact, reread the Sutta where one monk calls another monk a dumb donkey. Buddha brings the name-calling monk forward and whips him with a souvenir bull whip he bought when he took his family on vacation to Mexico. He then kicked that monk out of the Sangha.

Offline VisuddhiRaptor

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Re: Disappointing
« Reply #9 on: November 05, 2018, 07:45:00 pm »
I take back what I said about "self regulation." This troll definitely crosses the line.


When the Buddha taught about "self-regulation", it meant controlling your own mind and your own sense impressions.




Moderator Note:  Edited for content. 

VR: Consider moderating both tone and content in the future
« Last Edit: November 06, 2018, 05:17:02 am by Chaz »

Offline stillpointdancer

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Re: Disappointing
« Reply #10 on: November 06, 2018, 05:07:15 am »
I like to skim read the garbage for two reasons. One is that there might be a grain of truth and the other is that I like to at least mentally prepare a response to see if I could bring mindfulness to the situation. Mostly there isn't any point responding to people who are just observing the path rather than following it, so I don't. I keep reading for the odd perceptive comment that comes from an individual rather than a playbook.
“You do not need to leave your room. Remain sitting at your table and listen. Do not even listen, simply wait, be quiet, still and solitary. The world will freely offer itself to you to be unmasked, it has no choice, it will roll in ecstasy at your feet.” Franz Kafka

Offline zafrogzen

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Re: Disappointing
« Reply #11 on: November 07, 2018, 09:58:13 pm »
I don't mind personal insults directed at me. In some perverse way I take them as compliments. I draw energy from them.

If folks can't stand having an anonymous, totally unattached, fictitious self insulted in an online forum like this, how they gonna handle an attack in real life.

I admit that once in awhile I like giving someone a little poke in the ego myself. I originally tweaked VR first and he still hasn't got over it.

That said, I can understand the moderator's stance. Ongoing childish behavior does bring the whole forum down to a lower level.
My first formal meditation training was with Shunryu Suzuki in the 60's and later with Kobun, Robert Aitken and many other teachers (mainly zen). However, I've spent the most time practicing on my own, which is all I do now. I'm living in a rather isolated area so I miss connecting with other practitioners. Despite my interest in zen I've made an effort to remain secular. You can visit my website at http://www.frogzen.com

 


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