Author Topic: Is there a " real " Buddhism ?  (Read 3293 times)

Offline lostinsanscrit

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Is there a " real " Buddhism ?
« on: June 04, 2016, 09:16:26 am »
Hello there,

I have been blessed with genuine attraction and interest in many buddhism teachings with mantra chanting experiences but having hard time in connecting the dots. It looks like the buddha per se is more of a model than an historical being from the past, therefore all his teachings - including Theravada or other works supposedly done in his own time are probably not - by logic - the actual buddha words.

So, my Q is: Do buddhist nowadays prefer to think of the doctrine as coming from individual human interaction with the dharma itself for which - Mahayana been a good example - we experience Buddhism at different time in different context as in a sort of human cumulative effect ?  Or, did I miss something around the Buddha as an historical figure for which it should be quite obvious that at least some of the teaching comes directly from his own very mouth ?

Thank you for reading and commenting on the above.

Offline Ron-the-Elder

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Re: Is there a " real " Buddhism ?
« Reply #1 on: June 04, 2016, 10:39:44 am »
Dearest lostinsanscrit,

I am choosing to respond to your query as I would to any interested fellow student of "The Dhamma".  Your question is not only honest and opinionated, but it shows great insight.  Congratulations! You have touched on a sore spot with Buddhist religiostics, who are no different than any other type of religiostic in that they cling to what they call "Buddha's Words" as something immutable, somehow holy, and neither to be added to nor edited. 

Having lived many lifetimes with gurus, priests, soothsayers or the sort, Buddha himself prepared his thoughts and advice from life-times of personal experience in his response to a question put to him by elders of a community of people called The Kalamas in a work entitled, "The Kalama Sutta", " Now come to be known as "The Buddha's Charter of Free Inquiry":

http://www.accesstoinsight.org/lib/authors/soma/wheel008.html

What I have taken over the years reading and re-reading this document, studying it, applying its advisories, practicing what Buddha preached, was that as a serious student of Buddhism, we have a very personal obligation to ourselves and to the rightness and harmoniousness of our paths to verify and validate any and all advice received.  By doing so, personally verifying and validating, I have found that we have no need to "believe" in anything we are told by anyone, nor that  which we have read, for we will know for ourselves if what advice we have been given is in fact true, reality, "The Dhamma". 

In this way we are not  just believers or "Sheeple", but practitioners of "The Dhamma", who know its value for fact.

Hope this helps.

_/\_Ron
What Makes an Elder? :
A head of gray hairs doesn't mean one's an elder. Advanced in years, one's called an old fool.
But one in whom there is truth, restraint, rectitude, gentleness,self-control, he's called an elder, his impurities disgorged, enlightened.
-Dhammpada, 19, translated by Thanissaro Bhikkhu.

Offline Spiny Norman

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Re: Is there a " real " Buddhism ?
« Reply #2 on: June 05, 2016, 02:33:56 am »
So, my Q is: Do buddhist nowadays prefer to think of the doctrine as coming from individual human interaction with the dharma itself for which - Mahayana been a good example - we experience Buddhism at different time in different context as in a sort of human cumulative effect ?  Or, did I miss something around the Buddha as an historical figure for which it should be quite obvious that at least some of th teaching comes directly from his own very mouth ?

My personal view is that the suttas of the Pali Canon represent the closest approximation to what the Buddha actually taught, though some argue that stuff was was added in later.



Offline Spiny Norman

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Re: Is there a " real " Buddhism ?
« Reply #3 on: June 05, 2016, 02:37:30 am »
....."The Kalama Sutta", " Now come to be known as "The Buddha's Charter of Free Inquiry":

I think "charter of free inquiry" is a little over the top, Ron.  Basically the test in the Kalama Sutta is whether a particular set of teachings leads to the development of skillfull states. 

Offline Ron-the-Elder

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Re: Is there a " real " Buddhism ?
« Reply #4 on: June 05, 2016, 06:29:20 am »
....."The Kalama Sutta", " Now come to be known as "The Buddha's Charter of Free Inquiry":

I think "charter of free inquiry" is a little over the top, Ron.  Basically the test in the Kalama Sutta is whether a particular set of teachings leads to the development of skillfull states.

Hi, Spiny.  Good to read from you as always.

This is not my nomenclature for Buddha's response to The Kalamas.  It is the name given to it in the link I provided in my response to the respondent.

Best regards as always.

Ron
What Makes an Elder? :
A head of gray hairs doesn't mean one's an elder. Advanced in years, one's called an old fool.
But one in whom there is truth, restraint, rectitude, gentleness,self-control, he's called an elder, his impurities disgorged, enlightened.
-Dhammpada, 19, translated by Thanissaro Bhikkhu.

Offline Spiny Norman

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Re: Is there a " real " Buddhism ?
« Reply #5 on: June 05, 2016, 09:25:49 pm »
....."The Kalama Sutta", " Now come to be known as "The Buddha's Charter of Free Inquiry":

I think "charter of free inquiry" is a little over the top, Ron.  Basically the test in the Kalama Sutta is whether a particular set of teachings leads to the development of skillfull states.

Hi, Spiny.  Good to read from you as always.

This is not my nomenclature for Buddha's response to The Kalamas.  It is the name given to it in the link I provided in my response to the respondent.

Best regards as always.

Ron

Yes, I know, Ron, my comment still applies though. 
Regards
Spiny

Offline stillpointdancer

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Re: Is there a " real " Buddhism ?
« Reply #6 on: June 06, 2016, 02:25:13 pm »
Great replies. The real Buddhism is to test what is there yourself. If what you then do is reducing greed hatred and delusion within yourself, you know you are on the right track.
“You do not need to leave your room. Remain sitting at your table and listen. Do not even listen, simply wait, be quiet, still and solitary. The world will freely offer itself to you to be unmasked, it has no choice, it will roll in ecstasy at your feet.” Franz Kafka

Offline lostinsanscrit

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Re: Is there a " real " Buddhism ?
« Reply #7 on: June 09, 2016, 05:49:39 am »
Thank you all for your generous responses and encouragement

Offline ECS

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Re: Is there a " real " Buddhism ?
« Reply #8 on: July 22, 2016, 12:27:46 am »
Perhaps there is nothing is not Buddhism ........no one and nothing is out of Buddhism ...each moment regardless what one do , regardless living or non-living is in Buddhism ... so there is no real or un-real about Buddhism as Buddhism is not knowledge ......

 


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