Author Topic: I need help  (Read 1986 times)

Offline Rasputin

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Re: I need help
« Reply #15 on: October 15, 2018, 10:41:12 am »
I’m not sure why the arguing with someone who is being helpful. Perhaps we can all get along.

Offline meez

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Re: I need help
« Reply #16 on: October 15, 2018, 11:57:33 am »
I’m not sure why the arguing with someone who is being helpful. Perhaps we can all get along.

Yes, getting along would be ideal.

Offline Gibbon

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Re: I need help
« Reply #17 on: October 15, 2018, 12:36:50 pm »
That is a very good, very faithful translation of the Eight Verses.  Here are a couple of others, as well:

http://www.lotsawahouse.org/tibetan-masters/geshe-langri-thangpa/eight-verses-training-mind  -- I like the way this one flows

http://www.lamrim.co.za/resources/prayers/training-the-mind/

I have heard a teaching about how to apply this in everyday life: after waking up in the morning, read the text immediately and set the motivation to follow these practices today.  Then try your best to apply during the hectic daily activities.  At the end of the day, sit down and ask yourself: "How did I do today?"  If some lapses happened, note them without beating yourself up and resolve to do better tomorrow.

Rinse and repeat.

Now, the most important thing is to get depressed if you couldn't do it perfectly, just decide to do better the next day.  This is a tough practice and it has a connection with mindfulness, so it supplements sitting meditation really well.

Offline Chaz

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Re: I need help
« Reply #18 on: October 15, 2018, 02:24:15 pm »
Why does that kind of sweeping statemen not surprise me. Poor baby.

Old man with fake vain beard. Know nothing much about Dhamma and nothing about modern reality. Left-wing old Cultural Marxist hippy? 

:teehee:

Quote
394. What is the use of your matted hair, O witless man? What of your garment of antelope's hide? Within you is the tangle (of passion); only outwardly do you cleanse yourself.

Dhammapada

VR:  Are you suggesting Z's appearance has some sort of relevance in this conversation?
Yeah, I was wondering what a blatant ad hom has to do with it - especially one that is generally speaking incorrect as well.

Offline Chaz

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Re: I need help
« Reply #19 on: October 15, 2018, 02:27:29 pm »
That is a very good, very faithful translation of the Eight Verses.  Here are a couple of others, as well:

http://www.lotsawahouse.org/tibetan-masters/geshe-langri-thangpa/eight-verses-training-mind  -- I like the way this one flows

http://www.lamrim.co.za/resources/prayers/training-the-mind/

I have heard a teaching about how to apply this in everyday life: after waking up in the morning, read the text immediately and set the motivation to follow these practices today.  Then try your best to apply during the hectic daily activities.  At the end of the day, sit down and ask yourself: "How did I do today?"  If some lapses happened, note them without beating yourself up and resolve to do better tomorrow.

Rinse and repeat.

Now, the most important thing is to get depressed if you couldn't do it perfectly, just decide to do better the next day.  This is a tough practice and it has a connection with mindfulness, so it supplements sitting meditation really well.


Pema Chodron (one of those Marxist Hippy type dontcha know), came up with a brilliant idea.  Take all of the lojong sayings and put them on flash cards.  One is read each day and then send to the back for the next day.  It gives something to contemplate and practice.

Offline Gibbon

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Re: I need help
« Reply #20 on: October 15, 2018, 02:31:25 pm »

Pema Chodron (one of those Marxist Hippy type dontcha know), came up with a brilliant idea.  Take all of the lojong sayings and put them on flash cards.  One is read each day and then send to the back for the next day.  It gives something to contemplate and practice.

Nice!

Offline zafrogzen

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Re: I need help
« Reply #21 on: October 15, 2018, 04:59:46 pm »
I’m not sure why the arguing with someone who is being helpful. Perhaps we can all get along.

I don't think that someone is helpful who advises you that "where females are strongly represented in management" is somehow wrong, regardless of how good the individual females might be. Going in with that attitude isn't going to help you get along with any women you might find yourself working with.

I don't know if it's a zen myth or not, but I thought the historical Buddha ordained females and treated them equally and that it was only later that Buddhism fell into the pattern of sexism common in most medieval societies and even in some Theravada Buddhism to this day.
My first formal meditation training was with Shunryu Suzuki in the 60's and later with Kobun, Robert Aitken and many other teachers (mainly zen). However, I've spent the most time practicing on my own, which is all I do now. I'm living in a rather isolated area so I miss connecting with other practitioners. Despite my interest in zen I've made an effort to remain secular. You can visit my website at http://www.frogzen.com

Offline meez

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Re: I need help
« Reply #22 on: October 17, 2018, 09:12:49 am »
I don't think that someone is helpful who advises you that "where females are strongly represented in management" is somehow wrong, regardless of how good the individual females might be. Going in with that attitude isn't going to help you get along with any women you might find yourself working with.

If that is self-portrait, old man, I sounds like you have no idea about the 21st century workplace, as I posted. I advised our new friend to be very careful if working in the modern feminist politically correct workplace. Did you just miss the non-sense of Blasey-Ford vs Kavanaugh? Or were you cheering on LSD from Palo Alto for Blasey-Ford?

 :teehee:

VR:  Are you suggesting Z's appearance has some sort of relevance in this conversation?

Yes, good sir. I was suggesting the Flower-Power era of the 1960s has ended.  :namaste:

Ease up, VR.  Doesn't need to go there.

Offline Anemephistus

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Re: I need help
« Reply #23 on: October 17, 2018, 10:13:14 am »
For my part and with the intention to put something into this which I hope is of value...Views are dangerous.

I share my experience with a fair amount of freedom on this site. I work in a modern workplace, and was asked due to my difficulties with it if I wanted a miracle at one point.  This week I have been involved in multiple uses of physical force, I wear body armor at work, and I have been placed in charge of weapon teams and extractions, violence is part of my experience in this life. I face it often, far more often than many people in our society in the united states. I don't think I can be validly called emasculating names by anyone holding the view that peoples political opinions or social views create their suffering.  Suffering is a truth that is part of being alive with the exception that it is possible to end that suffering and still live.

I have personally seen the result of adherence to views destroy people and kill them. Gang members who are certain their ideologies are better than other views (yes they are about a lot more than drug turf) and people who view their lives as worthless and cannot escape the suffering of it. 

Somewhere in history I estimate that a pattern of justification for the actions of our ancestors started and they began to become divided by the will of their self natures. Somewhere in time those divisions which were of a nature to be dangerous to us were grown in a uncontrolled and instinctual manner and from the clouds of that storm came the lighting which has streaked through time. Everywhere it lands, it destroys. At the apex, the weapons of global destruction were made from ideas rooted in divisions, sowed in an environment of views along the evolution of time which with the energy spent contemplating divisive ideology gave reason to create the possibility of our total annihilation.

Equanimity cannot thrive in a view where a label gets in the way of the truth.  If a murder speaks the truth, it is still the truth, if a right winger, a left winger, a Marxist or a Monk speaks the truth it is still just a valid. I am not saying this because I think it, I am saying it because I work around murderers and other more standard people who disagree with me, because I live in the world and I see what we are doing to each other and I think we can be better.

I feel we have to look at the momentum of history and see where this all comes from, look at what we are trapped in. Humans are en-mass rallying to calls against each other everyday, people kill and die everyday from this phenomenon and to a lesser degree they suffer from it because they view a division and imagine how it would be if they were right or the world saw the view they had the same way. We do this instead of figuring out how to be where we are right now. I find There is no abrasion (or at least a lot less) against the mind when we interact with the person in front of us, I find the abrasion comes from interacting with who we think they are and what we think they represent.
 


Offline zafrogzen

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Re: I need help
« Reply #24 on: October 17, 2018, 01:21:16 pm »
I find There is no abrasion (or at least a lot less) against the mind when we interact with the person in front of us, I find the abrasion comes from interacting with who we think they are and what we think they represent.

That's the only way to get along, but it has to extend out from our hearts to cover other "groups" of persons as well.
My first formal meditation training was with Shunryu Suzuki in the 60's and later with Kobun, Robert Aitken and many other teachers (mainly zen). However, I've spent the most time practicing on my own, which is all I do now. I'm living in a rather isolated area so I miss connecting with other practitioners. Despite my interest in zen I've made an effort to remain secular. You can visit my website at http://www.frogzen.com

Offline Anemephistus

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Re: I need help
« Reply #25 on: October 17, 2018, 04:41:46 pm »
I find There is no abrasion (or at least a lot less) against the mind when we interact with the person in front of us, I find the abrasion comes from interacting with who we think they are and what we think they represent.

That's the only way to get along, but it has to extend out from our hearts to cover other "groups" of persons as well.

I agree.

That ability is based on a realization I think. I tried to describe it, but it was very long. I have seen people suffering badly, it came faster for me under those conditions. The world suffers, the solutions are not views rooted in the momentum of divisive ideologies. As I have heard it, the Buddha said to question everything. The scale of that question is more of a realization than words do it credit...I haven't found an end.

 


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