What is, is transdual. The transdual creates the dual.
But when it gets to deity yoga and such, it becomes polytheistic in approach and technique.
Finally, with realization those deities are dissolved into emptiness and it becomes panentheistic in effect and result (unless you're Gelug or Sakya).
Quote from: santamonicacj on June 27, 2012, 10:12:12 amBut when it gets to deity yoga and such, it becomes polytheistic in approach and technique. I'm not sure I follow .....I do diety yoga practices and they don't strike me at polytheistic in either approach or technique - at least not in practice. In fact I don't see it as theistic at all.Could you expand on that a bit perhaps?
QuoteFinally, with realization those deities are dissolved into emptiness and it becomes panentheistic in effect and result (unless you're Gelug or Sakya).What if you're a Gelug or Sakya?
Specifically I'm talking here about the creation phase of practice. When you visualize the deity you are creating a "damstig-sempa". That is just your mind imagining the deity.
They you invoke the "yeshe-sempa" which is the actual transcendent deity and merge it with your visualization. And since there are multiple deities you can do this with that sounds pretty polytheistic to me.
In the completion phase of practice the deity is dissolved into emptiness with everything else.
With a consummate practice this leaves the meditator with the ability to see the phenomenal world as being the manifestation of that perfect emptiness. The deity is gone, but has left behind enlightenment.
So if your teacher told you it wasn't a duck this is probably what he was referring to and you should listen to him. I qualified what I said before as being "just my opinion."
...my experience and the instruction I've recieved doesn't support your opinion.
Quote from: Mahasiddha Bodhisattva on June 21, 2012, 12:49:13 pmWhat is, is transdual. The transdual creates the dual.a.k.a. panentheism. My thesis is that Buddha Dharma can be said to be non-theistic from the Pali up through the Sutrayana, including Sutrayana Mahamudra and Dzogchen. Since the Sutrayana is a complete path to enlightenment this would seem to be the best choice for those that are still traumatized by the monotheism of the West.But when it gets to deity yoga and such, it becomes polytheistic in approach and technique. Finally, with realization those deities are dissolved into emptiness and it becomes panentheistic in effect and result (unless you're Gelug or Sakya).So you can't say it is just one way. It changes, depending on what you are practicing. That's why it can seem so complicated! But that's just my opinion...
Quote from: GoGet on June 27, 2012, 01:15:10 pm...my experience and the instruction I've recieved doesn't support your opinion.Yeah, there are very few people that see this the way I do--and those that do know better than to talk about it!
So, how did you come by this opinion?
Sounds polytheistic to me.
You're also taking the conduct of people as the universally accepted meaning of the teaching. If that works for you, that's fine.