Author Topic: Being one with the universe  (Read 283 times)

Offline Arkena

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Being one with the universe
« on: July 14, 2017, 01:25:50 am »
Is being one with the universe, of feeling you belong within it and a kinship for all life found within the teaching on "emptiness" of independant arising?

Incidentally i have realised that E=MC^2 and its meaning of conservation of energy and matter within a closed system...like the universe.... confirms the teaching of "emptiness".
« Last Edit: July 14, 2017, 01:29:19 am by Arkena »

Offline Rahul

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Re: Being one with the universe
« Reply #1 on: July 14, 2017, 03:31:45 am »

Incidentally i have realised that E=MC^2 and its meaning of conservation of energy and matter within a closed system...like the universe.... confirms the teaching of "emptiness".


Yes, that's one way of realizing the emptiness. All the mass is energy, and all the energy is essentially waves. And waves are in fact mathematical functions. Which means, the universe is a huge mathematical function at play. Wait... that's matrix. We are in a matrix. Seriously.

Offline ground

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Re: Being one with the universe
« Reply #2 on: July 14, 2017, 05:03:33 am »
Is being one with the universe, of feeling you belong within it and a kinship for all life found within the teaching on "emptiness" of independant arising?

Sorry but there is a teaching of dependent arising, not independant arising.

'One with the universe' is bound to miss the meaning of emptiness which is emptiness of true independent existence.

It is not about the universe on one hand and you on the other and then mixing everything together.

Incidentally i have realised that E=MC^2 and its meaning of conservation of energy and matter within a closed system...like the universe.... confirms the teaching of "emptiness".
The universe is not a closed system but an open one.
It is not about proving emptiness with teachings other than emptiness. It is exactly the other way round: emptiness of true  existence once understood correctly explains all other teachings like e.g. physics.
« Last Edit: July 14, 2017, 05:06:45 am by ground »

Offline ground

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Re: Being one with the universe
« Reply #3 on: July 14, 2017, 05:12:58 am »
Taking 'universe' as a metaphor: 'universe of appearances and possibilities'.

you may have a look here, maybe you find some inspiring words:
http://www.freesangha.com/forums/dzogchen/the-precious-treasury-of-the-basic-space-of-phenomena/

Offline Arkena

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Re: Being one with the universe
« Reply #4 on: July 14, 2017, 06:16:19 am »
Quote

Sorry but there is a teaching of dependent arising, not independant arising.

Sorry i must mean "emptiness of independent existence" not arising. Ty.

Quote
'One with the universe' is bound to miss the meaning of emptiness which is emptiness of true independent existence.

It is not about the universe on one hand and you on the other and then mixing everything together.

Emptiness of independent existence seems at least to me when mixed with the big bang theory to signal that everything matter and energy comes from the same source...hence when Emptiness is viewed thusly everything including us can be said to be one as all life...all matter...comes from the same source.

Incidentally i have realised that E=MC^2 and its meaning of conservation of energy and matter within a closed system...like the universe.... confirms the teaching of "emptiness".

Quote
The universe is not a closed system but an open one.

Traditionally the universe is viewed as an open system but from my limited understanding

"In classical mechanics. In nonrelativistic classical mechanics, a closed system is a physical system that doesn't exchange any matter with its surroundings, and isn't subject to any force whose source is external to the system".

If we take the universe and ASSUME it does not exchange matter or energy outside of it we can call it a closed system....im assuming we dont know this hence it is just theoretical to call the universe a closed system when viewed from outisde the universe? Again im just learning about this so feel free to point out any errors i have made :)

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It is not about proving emptiness with teachings other than emptiness. It is exactly the other way round: emptiness of true  existence once understood correctly explains all other teachings like e.g. physics.

I prefer to not regard buddhist teachings as beyond question, that they are infallible, so hence prefer to use other source material to confirm things to my satisfaction where possible. An enquiring mind is a questioning mind and to say anything is beyond question from my perspective is at best unwise. I just dont think that this a good path to knowledge. I do not mean to be disrespectful of the buddha or his teachings or of you, i am simply expressing my humble view and approach. I consider myself a follower of the buddha but not necessarily a buddhist.

Also surely offering another view into Buddhist teachings for those of a physics background can be nothing but good in my opinion :)

Again no offence is meant just saying my piece man :)


Offline ground

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Re: Being one with the universe
« Reply #5 on: July 14, 2017, 06:52:06 am »
Quote
It is not about proving emptiness with teachings other than emptiness. It is exactly the other way round: emptiness of true  existence once understood correctly explains all other teachings like e.g. physics.

I prefer to not regard buddhist teachings as beyond question, that they are infallible, so hence prefer to use other source material to confirm things to my satisfaction where possible. An enquiring mind is a questioning mind and to say anything is beyond question from my perspective is at best unwise. I just dont think that this a good path to knowledge. I do not mean to be disrespectful of the buddha or his teachings or of you, i am simply expressing my humble view and approach. I consider myself a follower of the buddha but not necessarily a buddhist.
I completely understand your point. I did not mean to establish emptiness of true existence as a belief or a teaching that is subject to belief or non-belief but from my persective emptiness of true existence can and should be established by means of rational analysis only and not by means of belief. Because only if one knows validly for oneself a change of habitual perceptions and experiences can arise.

So 'the other way round' meantioned above is like this:
1. consequent rational analysis of phenomena, applied concentrated logical thinking, establishes emptiness of true existence
2. perceiving phenomena as being empty of true existence explains all the contradictory views the world knows, all the contradictions between science and philosophies and religions and why people consider to be true what actually is empty of truth
3. imperturbable certainty arises in oneself

Also surely offering another view into Buddhist teachings for those of a physics background can be nothing but good in my opinion :)
This is not a totally uncommon approach. I've come across such a physics approach quite often actually so far in the context of western followers of prasangika madhyamaka philosophy. However my experience is that it is not as efficient as rational analysis. But of course everybody knows better than  everybody else.
« Last Edit: July 14, 2017, 06:57:09 am by ground »

Offline The Artis Magistra

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Re: Being one with the universe
« Reply #6 on: July 18, 2017, 10:29:40 pm »
Arkena, do you want all this trouble and having things questioned, or do you want something else? Whatever you want, why not use this thread to just say what you want?

Do you want there to be a Universal substance? That is fine if that is the case, lets just not use the disputing or fear of the disputing to hide away whatever we really want or want to discuss due to shame or fear of being shamed or being called "Not" a Buddhist or whatever silly things we all do to each other.

From your heart, what are all the things you want, want to say, want to be true, etc?

Offline Arkena

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Re: Being one with the universe
« Reply #7 on: July 19, 2017, 08:03:37 am »
I wanted confirmation of some one else realising my insight about emptiness when mixed with the big bang theory...

ie all matter and energy comes from the same source so all can be said to be one even in the infinite manifestations of form we find in the world. So seperation is part of the larger truth of all being one.

Just confirmation of someone sharing a similar insight.

Offline The Artis Magistra

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Re: Being one with the universe
« Reply #8 on: July 19, 2017, 10:53:41 am »
I agree with your idea, it is a good idea. Feel free also to email me at theartismagistra@gmail.com if you would ever like a friendly discussion or to tell me more wonderful ideas you have had and how they might have occurred to you.

 


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