Author Topic: Spiritual Materialism  (Read 5625 times)

Offline Ngawang Drolma

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Re: Spiritual Materialism
« Reply #60 on: December 16, 2009, 12:21:29 pm »
TMingyur I feel as though I'm not expressing myself well, or not being understood as I had hoped I would be.
So I wish to bow out of this conversation.  Thank you for your insights and clarifications, they are appreciated.

Kind wishes,
Laura

dumb bonbu

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Re: Spiritual Materialism
« Reply #61 on: December 16, 2009, 04:11:15 pm »
Quote
Do you think there is an element of "competition" to seeming knowledgeable in forums and that's maybe where people get sucked in??

if i'm being bitterly honest with myself then this cap definitely fits. but i can't blame that on someone's posting a thread, more on my own insecurities and pettiness. too often i'm interested in merely appearing clever (ironic as i don't know jack) rather than responding in a genuinely useful manner.

Quote
So how is it possible to practice Mahayana with spiritual materialism?

i don't know but a big part of why i take refuge in Amida Buddha is precisely because of the awareness of my ignorance and selfish craving, an awareness that in all likliness i've only begun to skim the surface of.

Gassho
db

Offline Cafael Dust

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Re: Spiritual Materialism
« Reply #62 on: December 20, 2009, 01:16:15 pm »
David said:

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If we acknowledge that all beings are responsible for their own kamma, and their own liberation, how is it possible to "take the responsibility to liberate all beings"?

Because we are their kamma.

p.s. Don't think I'm entering this debate with an argument for such notions as 'higher capacities' and so on, or that I'm coming from a Mahayana point of view. In my view, 'taking the responsibility to liberate all beings' isn't something one decides mentally to do, since such a decision is a bit like pledging to pull the world to heaven using one's own shoelaces.

However, I thought I could help illustrate that we don't exist in a vacuum and we can help each other. We do that naturally, however, as we progress in our practice; as we brush away the undergrowth from our path, the cage bars of others bend.
« Last Edit: December 20, 2009, 01:20:54 pm by Cafael Dust »

Offline caritas

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Re: Spiritual Materialism
« Reply #63 on: December 20, 2009, 02:17:32 pm »
This one is going to blow your mind.

You are building a rocket. Putting together pieces, gathering the fuel. You don't know the destination until the rocket's finished, although it gets more and more obvious as you get closer to completion. When you're done, the rocket takes its first, last, and only flight, with a flight-path that's determined by where you (the assembler) have already gone. Now, if you've done the work really well, everyone involved with the construction of your rocket gets pulled toward the goal with you. Even those who were only in the audience will get to see its flight, leading toward its destination. Finally, the audience will tell the story to those who didn't get to see it themselves, and they will know about rockets, and can have the destination pointed out to them. Other rockets will go up, and reach the end, and the story will continue.

Of course, there are all sorts of problems with rockets, and also travelling in rockets, to be solved.
For instance, maybe while you think you're building a rocket, you're actually just collecting nose-cones.
Can't fly very far with 1000 nose-cones, glittering in the dark, despite how nice and shiny and round they are.

Offline Cafael Dust

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Re: Spiritual Materialism
« Reply #64 on: December 20, 2009, 02:23:51 pm »
That's a good analogy.

Bird said to bird
it is selfish to sing
when others have no voice:
my choice

is to shun the music
till all can join it.


Bird said to bird:
music is heard.
Listen to the chorus
join me.

Offline caritas

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Re: Spiritual Materialism
« Reply #65 on: December 20, 2009, 05:09:28 pm »
How are you Cafael

Offline Cafael Dust

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Re: Spiritual Materialism
« Reply #66 on: December 21, 2009, 05:19:28 am »
I'm good, just got back to England after fourteen months in Bolivia, Chile, Peru, Ecuador and Argentina... still getting used to safety, comfort and affluence  :) . All a bit overwhelming, no houses made of mud here or grey faced children begging, or families eating from bins, for instance. It's like I'm seeing my country for the first time; a house that looked ordinary to me before I left seems like a palace now.

But already I'm beginning to miss the Quechua people, who have this cheerful (though sometimes apathetic) stoicism that invoked both irritation and admiration in me; people often talk about the particular challenges Buddhism faces in the Western mindset and I think I now understand better what they mean after seeing the widest of grins on toothless and weathered faces.

Thanks for asking and good to see you here.

Offline humanitas

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Re: Spiritual Materialism
« Reply #67 on: December 22, 2009, 08:05:55 pm »
This one is going to blow your mind.

You are building a rocket. Putting together pieces, gathering the fuel. You don't know the destination until the rocket's finished, although it gets more and more obvious as you get closer to completion. When you're done, the rocket takes its first, last, and only flight, with a flight-path that's determined by where you (the assembler) have already gone. Now, if you've done the work really well, everyone involved with the construction of your rocket gets pulled toward the goal with you. Even those who were only in the audience will get to see its flight, leading toward its destination. Finally, the audience will tell the story to those who didn't get to see it themselves, and they will know about rockets, and can have the destination pointed out to them. Other rockets will go up, and reach the end, and the story will continue.

Of course, there are all sorts of problems with rockets, and also travelling in rockets, to be solved.
For instance, maybe while you think you're building a rocket, you're actually just collecting nose-cones.
Can't fly very far with 1000 nose-cones, glittering in the dark, despite how nice and shiny and round they are.
:bow: :bow: :bow:
This post was made with 100% recycled karma

 


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