Author Topic: INFLOWS  (Read 5688 times)

Offline riju

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INFLOWS
« on: July 28, 2013, 01:22:44 am »
There is mention of Inflows and No outflows in Lotus Sutra at many places.
Briefly it treats our mind, body aggregates as a Vehicle.

Lotus sutra is also translated as Sutra of one vehicle.
Inflows increase vehicle size and make it faster with extended reach.

Would any body be interested in this topic?

Offline namumahaparinirvanasvaha

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Re: INFLOWS
« Reply #1 on: July 28, 2013, 02:23:55 am »
There is mention of Inflows and No outflows in Lotus Sutra at many places.
Briefly it treats our mind, body aggregates as a Vehicle.

Lotus sutra is also translated as Sutra of one vehicle.
Inflows increase vehicle size and make it faster with extended reach.

Would any body be interested in this topic?

I believe in the 2nd or 3rd chapter it mentions outflows and inflows as a practice of the sravakas,which the (new law) surpasses.

Do you have a quote,chapter,translator and page number?
(if you tell me the translator then page number I have most of the english translations of the Wonderful Lotus Sutra.)

Offline Alexey

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Re: INFLOWS
« Reply #2 on: July 28, 2013, 06:47:32 am »
"Inflow of rapture and pleasure like a cool water in a whole body from east to west, north to south etc" is mantioned by Buddha in discription of 2nd jhana. MN77
You can ask your question) - http://ask.fm/AlekseyKaverin

Suffering - should be understood
Origin of suffering - should be abandoned
Cessation of suffering - should be realised
The way leadding to cessation of suffering - should be developed

Offline riju

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Re: INFLOWS
« Reply #3 on: July 28, 2013, 09:28:35 pm »
Lotus sutra ....translator Burton Watson

Chapter 2 (expedient  means).
In this chapter on pages 15 onward "WITHOUT OUTFLOWS"  is repeatedly mentioned in many places.

Does it means INFLOWS, OR is there some subtle difference in between these two words.
Any clarification?

Offline namumahaparinirvanasvaha

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Re: INFLOWS
« Reply #4 on: July 28, 2013, 09:44:05 pm »
Im at work and  do not currently have the book with me.
If you can could you list all the page numbers that mention out flows(save me alot of time and homework)

Offline riju

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Re: INFLOWS
« Reply #5 on: July 28, 2013, 11:32:22 pm »
page 25  line17
page26   line 18
page 28 line 1

etc

Offline namumahaparinirvanasvaha

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Re: INFLOWS
« Reply #6 on: July 29, 2013, 02:28:15 pm »
Lotus sutra ....translator Burton Watson

Chapter 2 (expedient  means).
In this chapter on pages 15 onward "WITHOUT OUTFLOWS"  is repeatedly mentioned in many places.

Does it means INFLOWS, OR is there some subtle difference in between these two words.
Any clarification?

Okay this is what I found turn to page 335 line 15

Offline riju

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Re: INFLOWS
« Reply #7 on: August 14, 2013, 10:47:36 pm »
In the cosmic world of Gods there is give and take.
The Gods who take (Inflows) grow in power and size.
The Gods who give (Outflows) reduce in power and size.

The word Male is used for gods of Inflows.
And the word Female is used for gods of outflows.


So for us in our world..

Emptiness has Inflows and Outflows and hence is both Male and Female.
Buddhas have No Outflows, only inflows and hence they are pure Males.
Boddhisattvas with predominance of Inflows and less of Outflows are Males.
Most of Gods who have devotees are Males with large Inflows and
All devotees due to Outflows are Females.

Most of Hindu Gurus call themselves Males and they term all devotees as their Females.

All devotees of Lord Krishna (Hindu God) are called Gopis ( word for females)

Whole of Lotus sutra mentions the process of path of Bhoddisattvas and Buddhas as a path of Growth and hence path of NO OUTFLOWS.

Males with high emotions are changing slowly into Females due to the nature of emotion giving outflows.
A cool peaceful Female with no outflows is growing towards Malehood in next birth.

Wisdom is source of only Inflows and hence leads towards Malehood.

Offline riju

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Re: INFLOWS
« Reply #8 on: August 14, 2013, 11:10:13 pm »
Guatam Buddha in LOTUS SUTRA mentions all ARHATS as FOOLS, as they only emit outflows to disappear in salvation (Moksh)

Offline riju

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Re: INFLOWS
« Reply #9 on: August 14, 2013, 11:18:17 pm »
Extract from Chapter 2 Lotus sutra named Expediant Means


"Again, Shariputra, if there should be monks or nuns who claim that they already have attained the status of arhat, that this is their last incarnation, that they have reached the final nirvana, and that therefore they have no further intention of seeking anuttara-samyaksambodhi, then you should understand that such as these are all persons of overbearing arrogance. Why do I say this? Because if they are monks who have truly attained the status of arhat, then it would be unthinkable that they should fail to believe this Law. The only exception would be in a time after the Buddha had passed away, when there was no Buddha present in the world. Why is this? Because after the Buddha has passed away it will be difficult to find anyone who can embrace, recite, and understand the meaning of sutras such as this. But if persons at that time encounter another Buddha, then they will attain decisive understanding with regard to this Law.

"Shariputra, you and the others should with a single mind believe and accept the words of the Buddha. The words of the Buddhas, the Thus Come Ones, are not empty or false. There is no other vehicle, there is only the one Buddha vehicle.

"At that time the World-Honored One, wishing to state his meaning once more, spoke in verse form, saying:

There are monks and nuns
who behave with overbearing arrogance,
laymen full of self-esteem,
laywomen who are lacking in faith.
Among the four kinds of believers, the likes of these
number five thousand.
They fail to see their own errors,
are heedless and remiss with regard to the precepts,
clinging to their shortcomings, unwilling to change.
But these persons of small wisdom have already left;
the chaff among this assembly
has departed in the face of the Buddha's authority.
These persons were of paltry merit and virtue,
incapable of receiving this Law.
This assembly is now free of branches and leaves,
made up only of those steadfast and truthful.
Shariputra, listen carefully,
for the Law which the Buddhas have attained,

Offline riju

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Re: INFLOWS
« Reply #10 on: August 15, 2013, 04:40:49 am »
Guatam Buddha in LOTUS SUTRA mentions all ARHATS as FOOLS, as they only emit outflows to disappear in salvation (Moksh)

If OUTFLOWS are directed towards a Bhoddisattva or Buddha, this becomes the fastest method of achieving Buddhahood.

The dragon girl mentioned earlier followed this method,
(The dragon girl aged 8 converted into male and then became a Buddha)

Offline riju

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Re: INFLOWS
« Reply #11 on: August 15, 2013, 04:43:10 am »
Guatam Buddha in LOTUS SUTRA mentions all ARHATS as FOOLS, as they only emit outflows to disappear in salvation (Moksh)

If OUTFLOWS are directed towards a Bhoddisattva or Buddha, this becomes the fastest method of achieving Buddhahood.

The dragon girl mentioned earlier followed this method,
(The dragon girl aged 8 converted into male and then became a Buddha)

There is a special chapter no 13 on Encouraging Devotion in Lotus sutra.

Offline Ron-the-Elder

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Re: INFLOWS
« Reply #12 on: August 15, 2013, 05:58:02 am »
Guatam Buddha in LOTUS SUTRA mentions all ARHATS as FOOLS, as they only emit outflows to disappear in salvation (Moksh)


If OUTFLOWS are directed towards a Bhoddisattva or Buddha, this becomes the fastest method of achieving Buddhahood.

The dragon girl mentioned earlier followed this method,
(The dragon girl aged 8 converted into male and then became a Buddha)

There is a special chapter no 13 on Encouraging Devotion in Lotus sutra.



First of all, The Arahant has all the attainments of a Buddha.  Buddha spoke to this effect about his attained followers and encouraged them to teach Bhikkhus in The Holy Sangha.  Sariputta is but one example:

http://www.accesstoinsight.org/lib/authors/nyanaponika/wheel090.html

http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/kn/ud/ud.3.04.than.html

http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/kn/snp/snp.4.16.than.html

http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/an/an10/an10.007.than.html


 Even if it were not so, i seems to me that a Buddha who returns to teach The Dhamma for the benefit of all sentient beings would be far more effective than a billion bodhisattvah wannabe's as to teaching The Dhamma.  Or, at least that's the way it has worked in the relatively recent historical past.
« Last Edit: August 15, 2013, 06:04:17 am by Bodhisatta 2013 »
What Makes an Elder? :
A head of gray hairs doesn't mean one's an elder. Advanced in years, one's called an old fool.
But one in whom there is truth, restraint, rectitude, gentleness,self-control, he's called an elder, his impurities disgorged, enlightened.
-Dhammpada, 19, translated by Thanissaro Bhikkhu.

Offline riju

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Re: INFLOWS
« Reply #13 on: August 15, 2013, 08:21:01 am »

First of all, The Arahant has all the attainments of a Buddha.  Buddha spoke to this effect about his attained followers and encouraged them to teach Bhikkhus in The Holy Sangha.  Sariputta is but one example:



Sariputta remained an Arahant in that life till his death. He will become a Buddha much later after many births in the words of Guatam Buddha

(Extract below from chapter 3...Simile and Parable
Shariputra, in ages to come
you will become a Buddha, of universal wisdom, venerable,
bearing the name Flower Glow,
and you will save countless multitudes.
You will make offerings to numberless Buddhas,
be endowed with all the Bodhisattva practices,
the ten powers and other blessings,
and will realize the unsurpassed way.
After countless kalpas have passed,
your kalpa will be named Great Treasure Adornment.
Your world will be called Free from Stain,
pure, without flaw or defilement.
Its land will be made of lapis lazuli,
its roads bounded by ropes of gold,
and seven-jeweled trees in a jumble of colors
will constantly bear blossoms and fruit.
The bodhisattvas of that realm
will always be firm in intent and thought.
Transcendental powers and paramitas--
each will be endowed with all of these,
and under numberless Buddhas
they will diligently study the bodhisattva way.
Thus these great men
will be converted by the Buddha Flower Glow.
When that Buddha was still a prince,
he gave up his country, abandoned worldly glory,
and in his final incarnation
left his family and attained the Buddha way.
Flower Glow Buddha will continue in the world
for a life span of twelve small kalpas.
The numerous people of his land
will have a life span of eight small kalpas.
After that Buddha has passed into extinction,
the Correct Law will endure in the world
for thirty-two small kalpas,
saving living beings far and wide.
When the correct law has passed away,
the Counterfeit Law will endure for thirty-two kalpas.
The Buddha's relics will circulate widely;
heavenly and human beings everywhere will make offerings to them.
The actions of Flower Glow Buddha
will all be as I have said.
This most saintly and venerable of two-legged beings
will be foremost and without peer.
And he will be none other than you--
you should rejoice and count yourself fortunate!

Offline Ron-the-Elder

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Re: INFLOWS
« Reply #14 on: August 15, 2013, 09:35:03 am »
Thanks, riiju.

If you don't mind, would you please cite the source (link) associated with what you wrote regarding Sariputta.

Thanks   :namaste:
What Makes an Elder? :
A head of gray hairs doesn't mean one's an elder. Advanced in years, one's called an old fool.
But one in whom there is truth, restraint, rectitude, gentleness,self-control, he's called an elder, his impurities disgorged, enlightened.
-Dhammpada, 19, translated by Thanissaro Bhikkhu.

 


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