Author Topic: WHAT IS THE ANTIDOTE TO RESENTMENT?  (Read 1423 times)

Offline loopix

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WHAT IS THE ANTIDOTE TO RESENTMENT?
« on: September 01, 2019, 04:20:12 pm »
discuss.

Offline Chaz

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Re: WHAT IS THE ANTIDOTE TO RESENTMENT?
« Reply #1 on: September 01, 2019, 04:31:51 pm »

Offline stevie

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Re: WHAT IS THE ANTIDOTE TO RESENTMENT?
« Reply #2 on: September 01, 2019, 11:33:52 pm »
discuss.

That's funny because if there is resentment then the discussion the world knows supports this resentment and if there is no resentment why discuss about it?

The path taught by the Buddha is the only antitdot to all kinds of unease. So if anyone comes up with some kind of antidot to this or that kind of unease that isn't this path then that's an advice that omits the main thing.

 :dharma:

Offline loopix

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Re: WHAT IS THE ANTIDOTE TO RESENTMENT?
« Reply #3 on: September 03, 2019, 03:20:36 pm »
what on earth are you on about?

please elaborate. if anyone has any advice that is effective in regards of eliminating resentment, it is a path that omits "the main thing" ?
What is the main thing? In this context, it is eliminating resentment.

Did the buddha say anything specific about this? If not, why stay blind and not explore, and depend on scripture? The main thing here is to find a path that is effective in regards of clearing away any feelings of resentment towards those wh might have wronged you.

The easy answer is "forgive". Well, yes... But, how do you move on beyond that initial forgiveness. It is possible to forgive, and when forgiveness is complete, it is free of resentment, However, it is possible to forgive the person, or persons, but somehow the situation still contains elemnts of either frustration or something that instills a resentment towards, let|s say, a group of people, who might not be a specific set of individuals, but the group as a whole unto itself.

Let's take the most glaringly societal example: racism.

Someone is wronged by a black guy. He feels resentment towards black people. He forgives the black guy, but still feels resentment for black people, and has suspicius thoughts about africans as a whole, but is open to any african person approaching him..

The person in question resents the black population as a whole, but respects and more than acknowledges any black individual in it... The group itself though, is seen with some degree of contempt.

How to eliminate resentment towards a group, that as a whole, has wronged you, but clearly has individuals who more than regret and more than clearly show all and every sign of wanting to right all wrongs?

Racism, as an example, what would it take for a racist to forgive and see a whole group of "baddies" as "nice guys"

Obviously, dialogue, but what if dialogue in this case is limited to one way communcation, and any form of face-to-face dialogue would take action from the people in the mentioned group, seemingly wanting to, but avoiding any active action to achieve that dialogue?

A person with "group resentment" would keep on resenting a group, seeing individuals as valued peers, with limited "value" due to their "connection" to said group.

What kind of approach would one take, to achieve dialogue with someone who seems unwilling to talk face to face, but screams "COME ON WE'RE TRYING HERE!" fra afar?

how do you say "guys, come on, just clucking come on, to my face, please?" - "nah guy, you come here" - and when you do, rejection.

How do you engage in dialogue, in order to achieve mutual benefit to society as whole, when one single persons resentment for a whole group, can lead to the entire group being villified by the community at large?

You dont want to villify, but the wrongs done, in order to be forgiven for the group, needs an individual from that group to be approachable as an individual, right?


How do you approach someone who needs to be dragged with force to your face in order to even want to see it? Who will reject your approach if you show up at theirs?

Dialogue: let's have one.

TOPIC: RESENTMENT: HOW TO ELIMINATE IT.....


go.

Offline Chaz

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Re: WHAT IS THE ANTIDOTE TO RESENTMENT?
« Reply #4 on: September 03, 2019, 05:06:38 pm »
what on earth are you on about?

please elaborate. if anyone has any advice that is effective in regards of eliminating resentment, it is a path that omits "the main thing" ?
What is the main thing? In this context, it is eliminating resentment.

Did the buddha say anything specific about this? If not, why stay blind and not explore, and depend on scripture? The main thing here is to find a path that is effective in regards of clearing away any feelings of resentment towards those wh might have wronged you.

The easy answer is "forgive". Well, yes... But, how do you move on beyond that initial forgiveness. It is possible to forgive, and when forgiveness is complete, it is free of resentment, However, it is possible to forgive the person, or persons, but somehow the situation still contains elemnts of either frustration or something that instills a resentment towards, let|s say, a group of people, who might not be a specific set of individuals, but the group as a whole unto itself.

Let's take the most glaringly societal example: racism.

Someone is wronged by a black guy. He feels resentment towards black people. He forgives the black guy, but still feels resentment for black people, and has suspicius thoughts about africans as a whole, but is open to any african person approaching him..

The person in question resents the black population as a whole, but respects and more than acknowledges any black individual in it... The group itself though, is seen with some degree of contempt.

How to eliminate resentment towards a group, that as a whole, has wronged you, but clearly has individuals who more than regret and more than clearly show all and every sign of wanting to right all wrongs?

Racism, as an example, what would it take for a racist to forgive and see a whole group of "baddies" as "nice guys"

Obviously, dialogue, but what if dialogue in this case is limited to one way communcation, and any form of face-to-face dialogue would take action from the people in the mentioned group, seemingly wanting to, but avoiding any active action to achieve that dialogue?

A person with "group resentment" would keep on resenting a group, seeing individuals as valued peers, with limited "value" due to their "connection" to said group.

What kind of approach would one take, to achieve dialogue with someone who seems unwilling to talk face to face, but screams "COME ON WE'RE TRYING HERE!" fra afar?

how do you say "guys, come on, just clucking come on, to my face, please?" - "nah guy, you come here" - and when you do, rejection.

How do you engage in dialogue, in order to achieve mutual benefit to society as whole, when one single persons resentment for a whole group, can lead to the entire group being villified by the community at large?

You dont want to villify, but the wrongs done, in order to be forgiven for the group, needs an individual from that group to be approachable as an individual, right?


How do you approach someone who needs to be dragged with force to your face in order to even want to see it? Who will reject your approach if you show up at theirs?

Dialogue: let's have one.

TOPIC: RESENTMENT: HOW TO ELIMINATE IT.....


go.

The antidote?  Let go of resentment.

You can learn to do this by practicing Shamatha.  Think of the resentment you feel as just another thought.  When resentment arises, don't cling to it. Let it go. 

Tonglen practice may also help.  Exchange resentment for gratitude.  Cultivate gratitude.

Remember, you can only deal with your own stuff.

Offline loopix

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Re: WHAT IS THE ANTIDOTE TO RESENTMENT?
« Reply #5 on: September 03, 2019, 05:59:14 pm »
saying things like "learn samata" and simple statements like "let go of resentment" is easy. Actually applying samata to let go of resentment takes time, not to mention being able to attain some distance to the topic at hand that seeded, caused and maintains that resentment.

Ease, cool and calm gets you a far way. But when the causes of said resentment are present each and everyday, letting go of resentment that gets reinforced everyday, is easier said than done, and kept done.

You can rid yourself of the resentment caused that day, and it's back the next, because the causes and conditions of that resentment is there, each and every day.  It will not disapear or go away until one individual from that shitty group of people, full of lovely individuals, steps up and says "hey guy, i'll listen"

....sometimes the very fact of being all samata vipassana guru retreat meditation super duper uber pracitioner dude is the cause of people not allowing themselves to be decent enough to recognize patience and forgiveness for it's worth, and start taking it as something to be taken for granted, and play the victim card if it is not given immediately after the offence is.

people are strange.

Offline stevie

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Re: WHAT IS THE ANTIDOTE TO RESENTMENT?
« Reply #6 on: September 03, 2019, 09:30:57 pm »
what on earth are you on about?

please elaborate. if anyone has any advice that is effective in regards of eliminating resentment, it is a path that omits "the main thing" ?
What is the main thing? In this context, it is eliminating resentment.

Please read accurately what I've written:
Quote
The path taught by the Buddha is the only antitdot to all kinds of unease. So if anyone comes up with some kind of antidot to this or that kind of unease that isn't this path then that's an advice that omits the main thing.

So I've said:
If one wants to get rid of the unease of resentment then the path that leads to cessation of unease taught by the Buddha is the antidot.
Why did I say this?
Because if one uses an alleged antidot against only one kind of unease one is merely replacing one kind of unease by another.

So what then is the antidot?

The antidot is:
Right View
Right Resolve/Intention
Right Speech
Right Action
Right Livelihood
Right Effort
Right Mindfulness
Right Concentration

 :anjali:

Offline loopix

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Re: WHAT IS THE ANTIDOTE TO RESENTMENT?
« Reply #7 on: September 04, 2019, 07:12:48 am »
forgive me, but you are basicly saying "the antidote is the dharma" - which is like hearing someone saying "dude, I need to turn my life around, I'm in pain, I need to get rid of trauma caused by years of abuse and whatnot" - and some know it all comes by and says "turn to God, go in peace".

Forgive my french, it is complete and utter regurgitation of the words of people with holier than thou lives, having never had to live with the actual misery of the world.


No, I asked: what is the antidote to resentment, actual remedy, not the basic nonsensical answers clergy without any experience with the misery of the world, like actual people, not "holy beings in robes" who are being  bowed and prostrated to at every time of day.

Sorry, outragous, but truth.


Actual action, actual appliable practice, not the summarization of scripture and "do some lam rim".

No, actual "this is how the thought process works, this is the path to giude your emotions through, and this  is the way to apply the proper meditation in order to faciliate that process"


...not "follow the eightfold path and be blessed, friend".

(edit: spell check and outrage notification: yes, I have some trouble with some aspects of clergy being held in high regard in ways that make them blind to what they teach, and the people who live lives they do not have the cpacity to understand, forgive, will not elaborate unless asked  :headbow: )

(forgive the insane wrath, but holy bejesus, some people just are well read with no experience.)
« Last Edit: September 04, 2019, 07:18:32 am by loopix »

Offline loopix

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Re: WHAT IS THE ANTIDOTE TO RESENTMENT?
« Reply #8 on: September 04, 2019, 07:14:41 am »
so to tone it out and down, and by that up: how do you correct the views of people who hold "right view" that is just wrong, in the sense of actual real world problems?

This just got bigger and waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay controversial. Movd thread to Danger Zone?

Lol. holy mother of a worm, I'm in trouuble here  :eek: :wacky:

Offline Anemephistus

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Re: WHAT IS THE ANTIDOTE TO RESENTMENT?
« Reply #9 on: September 04, 2019, 01:42:30 pm »
Gratitude. Compassion. The wisdom to understand instead of judge. Curating the ability to let go of false views and letting life as it really is enter our understanding instead of keeping life as we would have liked it or wanted it from poisoning our understanding and compassion.

Many things happen to us. The events that lead to some of those things rise deep from circumstances which we cannot know and do not control. Being ignorant of what fully gives rise to the hardships we face, replacing what is with what we think should be instead of living what should be within what is brings resentment.

We think: I have been wronged, we have all felt this, me, you, everyone. Perhaps we were very wronged and it hurt us deeply, maybe its just an annoying pattern of behavior. Whatever the case, we often do not see it in the full light of its composite nature.

In my best assessment, the critical difference between what becomes a resentment and what does not is that we go into our thoughts and we visit the resentment. It becomes a whisper that speaks to us in the presence of those things which we remind ourselves look like it's nature and in the presence of those who we attribute it's existence to. 

As it really is, as best I can tell, is we are the source of our resentments. We keep them and tell ourselves it is the normal reaction to whatever circumstance we have faced which we are resenting. This may be true, maybe where we live it is normal to have these metal formations, maybe it is normal everywhere and part of being human, there is no shame in experiencing resentment. But if one want to be rid of resentment then there is work to be done.

Life feels hard, bad situations feel like they still matter, people who wronged us feel like we deserved better. With the truth on our side though all we have is what happened, the illusion anything else was every going to be part of our story, that anything else was every going to be different than it was is just a figment of the mind wanting. It hurts and we have all done it. It is not based on what happened but on how we are reacting to what happened...which is good news because that means we own our part of it, how we feel and what we interpret is coming from us.

Did the object of our resentment know better than to perform the harmful action? If so does the harmful action come from something inside them which makes them suffer too? Do we understand the full circumstances in the life of the person we resent which gave rise to them causing us harm?  Do we re-enforce our own illusions about what we would have liked them to do instead? Do we keep them near us without any sign that the situation will be addressed or healed? Have we become physically separate without really letting letting go of our own pain? Have we evaluated how we can use the hurt in our story to show others freedom from that same pain? 

There is a lot to do if resentment has a lot of momentum, but there is also very little we need to do once we are ready to let it go.

Depending on the severity of the actions we may never include a person we resent in our lives again, I have been in this position, but the impression they left that gets left in the heart stays, we choose what to do with the impression.

Much love to you all!

Offline stevie

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Re: WHAT IS THE ANTIDOTE TO RESENTMENT?
« Reply #10 on: September 05, 2019, 01:16:32 am »
forgive me, but you are basicly saying "the antidote is the dharma" -

Dear loopix,

What I am saying is: Without being embedded in the 8-fold path there is no antidot against any kind of unease because an alleged antidot outside the sphere of all limbs of the path is either ineffective or just causes replacement of one unease by another.

A holistic approach is necessary:
1. make sure you have implemented all limbs of the 8-fold path
2. based on the practice of the 8-fold path you may apply an antidot against a specific affliction/unease.

Since the kind of 8-fold path that is practiced depends on lineage and there are different states of progress on the path there is a multitude of antidots ... just to mention some of these: some cure afflictions with emptiness, some cure afflictions with the four immeasurables, some cure afflictions with mindfulness, some cure afflictions with avoidance/renunciation, some cure afflictions with the discipline arising from contemplating karma and its effets and some make use of all kinds of antidots depending on circumstances.

 :anjali: :dharma:

« Last Edit: September 05, 2019, 01:28:47 am by stevie »

Offline loopix

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Re: WHAT IS THE ANTIDOTE TO RESENTMENT?
« Reply #11 on: September 05, 2019, 03:50:26 am »
thank you!  :headbow:

Offline Chaz

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Re: WHAT IS THE ANTIDOTE TO RESENTMENT?
« Reply #12 on: September 05, 2019, 09:47:43 am »
so to tone it out and down, and by that up: how do you correct the views of people who hold "right view" that is just wrong, in the sense of actual real world problems?

You can't.  People will hold the views they hold.  Not much you can do.

but what does that have to do with resentment?

 


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